The Chairman asked: When did Comrade Shehu come to China? (Answer: May of last year.) At that time I said, in the end, will it be Marxism-Leninism that is victorious, or revisionism? This is a question of the struggle between two lines. I also said, as to which side will be victorious, it cannot yet be seen, a conclusion cannot yet be drawn. There are two possibilities. It is possible that revisionism will strike us down, and it is possible that we will defeat revisionism. Why do I place defeat as the first possibility? Looking at the problem this way is advantageous; one can avoid underestimating the enemy. For many years, the struggle within our Party was not made public. At the Seven Thousand Cadres Conference in 1961, I gave a speech at that time, in which I said that revisionism wants to overthrow us. If we do not struggle, in as little as a few years, or as long as a dozen or several decades, China could change its color. This speech was not published, but some problems had already been seen at that time. In the period from '61 to '65, why did we say that much of our work was not done well? This was not a polite remark, it was the truth. In the past, we only grasped individual problems, individual figures. From the winter of '53 to '54, we struggled against Gao and Rao. In '59, we brought down Peng Dehuai and Huang Kecheng. In addition, we also carried out some struggles in cultural circles and in the countryside and factories, that is, the Socialist Education Movement. You are also aware of this, but none of it solved the problem, we did not find a form, a method to openly and comprehensively expose our dark side from the bottom up, so this time we must carry out the Great Cultural Revolution. Some preparations were also made for the Great Cultural Revolution. In November 1965, a critical article against Wu Han was published. It couldn't be written in Beijing, so we had to go to Shanghai to find Yao Wenyuan. This whole affair was started by Jiang Qing and her group, though of course I was told about it beforehand. After the article was written, it was given to me to read. She also said: Only I am allowed to read it, it cannot be given to Zhou Enlai and Kang Sheng, otherwise people like Liu and Deng will also want to read it. Liu, Deng, Peng, and Lu were opposed to this article. After the article was published, it was reprinted throughout the country, but Beijing did not reprint it. (Hunan also did not reprint it, Zhang Pinghua made a self-criticism—someone interjected). I was in Shanghai at that time. I said to print the article as a pamphlet for all provinces to print and distribute, just not in Beijing. Peng Zhen notified the publishing houses not to reprint it. The Beijing Municipal Party Committee was a place where not a drop of water could trickle in, not a single needle could be stuck in. Hasn't it been reorganized now? It's still not enough, it must be reorganized again. When the reorganization of the Municipal Committee was announced, we added X garrison divisions, now there are X garrison divisions. The previous X divisions were good, but too scattered. Now the Red Guards are helping us, but some are also unreliable. Some wear dark glasses and masks, carrying clubs and knives, smashing things everywhere, beating people, killing people, they have killed people, and wounded people. Most of these people are children of high-ranking cadres. Like the daughters of He Long and Lu Dingyi. So the army is not without its problems. In December '65, the Luo problem was solved. On June 1, '66, the first Marxist-Leninist big-character poster was broadcast. In August, the Red Guards appeared and mobilized the masses. Last year, Nie Yuanzi wrote a big-character poster. I was in Hangzhou at the time. One day I saw this big-character poster, and I telephoned Kang Sheng and Chen Boda, telling them to broadcast this big-character poster. And so big-character posters flew all over the sky. The attached middle schools of Qinghua and Beida wrote two pieces of material. I read them, and on August 1st I wrote a letter to the Red Guards of these two schools. Afterwards, the Red Guards really took off. On August 18th, I received several hundred thousand Red Guards, and then the Eleventh Plenary Session of the Eighth Central Committee was convened. I wrote a big-character poster of over two hundred characters. At that time, from the central to the local levels, some responsible persons opposed the student movement, opposed the dictatorship of the proletariat, and engaged in a White Terror. This is how the problem of Liu and Deng was exposed. Right now, the two sides are in a decisive battle, it is not yet resolved. This year in March or April, the shape of things may become clear. The resolution of the problem may come in March or April of next year, or it may take even longer. Several years ago, I wanted to purge several million. That was empty talk, they wouldn't listen! There was nothing to be done. The People's Daily had its power seized twice, but it just wouldn't listen to me. Last year I declared that I would not read the People's Daily. I said it several times, but they just wouldn't listen. It seems my ways are no longer effective in China, because the universities and middle schools have long been in the hands of Liu, Deng, and Lu. We couldn't get in, there was nothing to be done.

The problems exposed within our Party can be divided into several groups of people:

One group is those who engaged in the democratic revolution. During the period of the democratic revolution, they could cooperate. They approved of overthrowing imperialism and feudalism, they also approved of overthrowing bureaucrat-capitalism, but they did not approve of overthrowing the national bourgeoisie. They approved of distributing land to the peasants, but they did not approve of collectivization. This group includes some so-called old cadres.

The second group is people who joined the Party only after liberation. Eighty percent joined the Party only after liberation. Among them, a portion became cadres, some became branch secretaries, county Party secretaries.

The third group is the Kuomintang personnel who were kept on. Some of these people were formerly Communists, but later turned traitor and published anti-communist statements in the newspapers. We didn't know at the time, but now it has been found out. They do not support the Communist Party, they oppose the Communist Party.

The fourth group is the children of landlords, rich peasants, counter-revolutionaries, bad elements, rightists, and the bourgeoisie. After liberation, they entered the universities and grasped a portion of power. Not all are bad people, some are on our side, but some are anti-communist. In short, there are not many bad people in China, probably no more than a few percent. For example, landlords, rich peasants, counter-revolutionaries, and bad elements are at most five percent, about 35 million people. They are dispersed, dispersed throughout the various villages, cities, and streets. If they were concentrated together, with weapons in their hands, they would be a great enemy. They are a class that has been extinguished. Their representative figures among the 35 million are at most only a few hundred thousand, and they are also dispersed. So as soon as the big-character posters, the mass movement, and the Red Guards appeared, they were scared to death.

I am suspicious of a large portion of university students, especially in the liberal arts. If the Cultural Revolution is not carried out, they will become revisionist elements, engaging in revisionism. The liberal arts students cannot write essays, the philosophy students cannot explain social phenomena, and then there is economics, there are so many! Now it seems there is hope, the struggle is very fierce.

The masses have all been mobilized, all bad things can be thrown away. We are optimistic about consolidating the dictatorship of the proletariat. Since I spoke with Comrade Shehu last year, I have become more optimistic.

(Comrade Kapo said: The revolutionary line represented by Chairman Mao has achieved a great victory.)

Right now, one can only say that a considerable victory has been achieved. By this time next year, one might be able to say so. But we might be defeated by the enemy. If we are defeated, so be it. There will always be people to make revolution. Some people say that China loves peace. That is bragging. In fact, China is bellicose. I am one such person. Being bellicose, it is not so easy for revisionism to emerge.

(Comrade Kapo said: It won't do not to engage in struggle, otherwise how can the revolution be realized?)

Exactly! It is not as easy for China to practice revisionism as it is for the Soviet Union. China was a semi-feudal, semi-colonial country, oppressed for over a hundred years. Our state was won by the army. The schools were left untouched. Some leaders of the Party and government were appointed, for example, weren't Cao Diqiu and Chen Pixian appointed? They were elected later. I do not believe in elections. China has more than two thousand counties. If each county elects two people, that's over four thousand; if four, that's over ten thousand. Where is there a place big enough to hold a meeting? How can so many people know each other? I was elected by Beijing, but many people have never seen me! How can they elect someone they have never even seen? It is only by reputation. The Premier and I are both known by reputation. It's not as good as the Red Guards; their leaders have at least spoken with them. The Red Guards are also constantly splitting. In the summer they are revolutionary, in the winter they become counter-revolutionary. In the summer they are a minority, in the winter they change from a minority to a majority. "Jinggangshan" and Nie Yuanzi were oppressed and very revolutionary. From December of last year to January of this year, they split. But no matter what, there are always more good people. Anarchism is now in vogue, doubting everything, overthrowing everything, and in the end it comes down on one's own head. That won't do. But through struggle, the mistaken people will never be able to stand their ground. On the streets there are big-character posters to overthrow XXX and XXX. There are even more big-character posters to overthrow XXX and XXX. XXX is XXX, in charge of several ministries. The XX Ministry wants to overthrow him. The call to overthrow XX was raised by the XX Military Region Command, and a few days later they themselves were overthrown. But there is an eternal truth, which is that the absolute majority of Party members, League members, and the people are good.