There Are Two Intermediate Zones

THERE ARE TWO INTERMEDIATE ZONES*
{September 1963; January and July 1964)
I
All of you are concerned about the situation, particularly the international
situation. Some comrades are concerned that the collaboration between the
Soviet Union and the United States will bring disadvantages to us. I always
believe what Wang Xifeng says in A Dream of Red Mansions: "Bigness has the
difficulties of being big."^®' Now the U.S. and the Soviet Union both have
big difficulties. Rost, chairman of the U.S. Policy Committee, once published
an article whose keynote was that both the U.S. and the Soviet Union faced
many difficulties and that these difficulties were insurmountable. I don't know
this man, but our views happen to coincide at some points. The United
States is being rebuffed everywhere, both domestically and internationally;
Khrushchev too. Don't forget this point. In the words of Leng Zbdng in A
Dream of Red Mansions, "A centipede does not topple over even when
dead."^®^ The American magazine Hammer and Steel also says that the U.S. is
like a hollowed big tree, leafy outside but insect-ridden inside.
In my view there are two intermediate zones: the first, Asia, Africa and
Latin America and the second, Europe. Japan and Canada are not happy with
the United States. The six-nation Common Market,^®® represented by De
Gaulle,"^ is made up of powerful capitalist countries. Japan in the East is a
powerful capitalist country. They are unhappy with the U.S. and the Soviet
Union. Are the Eastern European countries that satisfied with Khrushchev of
the Soviet Union? I don't believe so. Things are evolving and contradictions
are revealing themselves. In the past few years the French were trying to assert
their independent character, but not to the degree they are today. The
contradictions between the Soviet Union and Eastern European countries are
good as those between China and the Japanese Liberal Democratic Party or
China and the Ikeda"® faction. This is something we should think about.
What's the reason? Because the U.S. and the Soviet Union both have nuclear
weapons and want to dominate the world. The Liberal Democratic Party is,
however, under American control. So far as its international status is con
cerned, Japan is secondary to the U.S. and the Soviet Union. Secondary
countries also include Britain, France, West Germany, Italy, and so on. Thus
we have some work to do. Japanese monopoly capitalists are not that united
with the U.S. Though Britain is quite close to the U.S., they are not that
united either. France annoys the U.S., and West Germany has become
important. It will inevitably confront the U.S.
So when we talk about intermediate zones, we refer to two separate parts.
The vast economically backward countries in Asia, Africa and Latin America
constitute the first. Imperialist and advanced capitalist countries represented
by Europe constitute the second. Both are opposed to American control.
Countries in Eastern Europe, on the other hand, are against control by the
Soviet Union. This trend is quite obvious.
(January 5, 1964)
(From the verbatim record)

III
The United States reaches out to the entire West Pacific and Southeast
Asia. Its reach is too long. The Seventh Fleet, stationed in this area, is the
biggest in the U.S.; it has six aircraft carriers, half of America's total number
of 12. The Sixth Fleet is stationed in the Mediterranean. When we shelled
Jinmen in 1958, the Americans got scared and maneuvered part of the Sixth
Fleet eastward. The United States has Europe and Canada under its control;
it controls all of Latin America, except for Cuba. It has now reached out to
Africa and is waging a war in the Congo.^'®
People all over Asia, Africa and Latin America are opposed to U.S.
imperialism. A large number of people in Europe, North America and Oceania
are against U.S. imperialism. Some of the imperialists are against U.S.
imperialism too. De Gaulle's opposition to the U.S. is evidence. We now put
forward the view that there are two intermediate zones: Asia, Africa and Latin
America are the first, and Europe, North America and Oceania, the second.
Japan belongs to the second intermediate zone too. The monopoly capitalists
in Japan are not happy with the U.S.; some openly oppose it. Although there
are still others who rely on it, in my view, in the course of time many of these
people will finally throw out the Americans sitting on their backs.
(July 10, 1964)
(From the verbatim record)

--- Notes

* These are excerpts from three talks: (1) at the Working Conference of the Central
Committee of the Communist Party of China, (2) with Kikunami Katsumi, Politburo
member of the Japanese Communist Party, and (3) Japanese Socialists.
also developing and their relations are very tense. Relaxation in the world
situation? Don't be deceived by all that. In my view it is not so easy for the
Soviet Union and the U.S. to come to an agreement. Many Atlantic countries
will not support the U.S. either. De Gaulle has said everywhere that France
will not be a satellite country; their struggle is one of control and countercontrol. Khrushchev claims that we follow the same line as De Gaulle; in fact we
have never seen De Gaulle. We mainly rely on the people domestically and
internationally, not on the leaders of major countries. People are reliable.
(September 28, 1963)
(From the verbatim record)
II
We have diplomatic relations with the Soviet Union; we are two countries
in the socialist camp. But the relations between our two countries are not as not as good as the relations between China and the Japanese Liberal Democratic Party, nor as good as China's relations with the Ikeda faction. This is something well worth our thinking about. What is the reason? It is because both the United States and the Soviet Union have nuclear weapons and want to dominate the world, while the Liberal Democratic Party is under American control. In terms of international standing, Japan occupies second place after the United States and the Soviet Union. Britain, France, West Germany, Italy, and other countries are also in this second rank. We still have work to do. Japanese monopoly capital is not that united with the United States. Britain is relatively close to the United States, but not that united either. France annoys the United States. The position of West Germany has become important, and it will inevitably come into confrontation with the United States.

So when we talk about intermediate zones, there are two parts: one part refers to the vast economically backward countries of Asia, Africa, and Latin America; the other part refers to the imperialist countries and advanced capitalist countries represented by Europe. Both of these parts oppose American control. In the Eastern European countries, there is the question of opposing Soviet control. This situation appears quite obvious.

(January 5, 1964)
(From the verbatim record)

(Printed according to Mao Zedong's Selected Works on Diplomacy published by Central Party Literature Press and World Affairs Press in 1994. Original title: 'There Are Two Intermediate Zones.')

NOTES
[1] Part one is an excerpt from Mao Zedong's speech at the Working Conference of the Central Committee of the Communist Party of China. Part two is an excerpt from Mao Zedong's talk with Kikunami Katsumi, member of the Politburo of the Japanese Communist Party. Part three is an excerpt from Mao Zedong's talk with the Japanese Socialists Sasaki Kozo, Kuroda Hisao, Hosako Kanemitsu, and others.
[2] See chapter 6 of A Dream of Red Mansions.
[3] Khrushchev was at that time First Secretary of the Central Committee of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union and Chairman of the Council of Ministers of the USSR.
[4] See chapter 2 of A Dream of Red Mansions.
[5] De Gaulle was at that time the President of France.
[6] The Six-Nation Common Market, i.e., the European Common Market, was an international monopoly alliance formed on January 1, 1958 by France, the Federal Republic of Germany, Italy, the Netherlands, Belgium, and Luxembourg.
[7] Ikeda refers to Ikeda Hayato, who was at that time the President of the Japanese Liberal Democratic Party and Prime Minister of the Japanese Cabinet.
[8] 'Shelling at Jinmen' — see note [2] on page 23 of this volume.