The Oppressed Will Finally Rise Up

Date: 1963-08-09
Source: en:FLP-Diplomacy
THE OPPRESSED WILL FINALLY RISE UP*
(August 9, 1963)
Chairman Mao Zedong (hereinafter referred to as Mao): I am very
glad to see you. I met with a group of African friends yesterday. We and
you, feeling equal, are conversing well. We do not impose our view on
you, nor do you impose your view on us. We help and support each other
and learn from each other's experience in our struggles.
Prime Minister Ahdirashid Ali Shermarke (hereinafter referred to as
Shermarke): In past days we have had fruitful talks with Premier Zhou
Enlai. I feel very satisfied with the result of the talks. I am certain that
relations between our two countries are strengthened.
Mao: You talked about politics, economics and other questions?
Shermarke: We talked about the general international situation, especially relations between our two countries. Our two sides have reached
agreement on a joint communique and an economic and technical cooperation protocol.
Mao: Our economies are not good yet, so we cannot meet your requests
now. We are making endeavors and shall make progress in the end, in
several years or in decades. By then we shall be able to meet our foreign
friends needs better and to a greater extent. This is our hope that the
oppressed nations and peoples in the world make joint efforts in the struggle
for political, economic and cultural independence and liberation and strive
to be liberated from the oppression of imperialism and colonialism.
You know, our country is not completely liberated yet, because Taiwan
is still not liberated. To Western countries, China does not seem to exist,
yet, again, it does seem to exist. Dulles said that China seemed to exist
as well as not exist. Why is this? During the Korean War Chinese were
fighting battles against the United States, so the West felt China's existence.
Then why should it not? They assume that China is in bad circumstances
and will soon decline, collapse and fall from power; China is hopeless and
* This is Mao Zedong's talk with Somali Prime Minister Ahdirashid Ali Shermarke.
does not seem to exist. The West holds the same view about the African
situation. Westerners think Africa is a place for nonAfricans, but if Africa
belongs to the Westerners, does it exist then? Now It seems they are
beginning to recognize the existence of Africa. Dozens of African countries
have won independence and the people in countries that have not won
independence are carrying out struggles. Asian and African countries are a
headache to the West; so are Latin American countries. In the past,
countries on the three continents served as reserves for Western imperialist
countries, and now they feel the three continents are ganging together to
cause disturbances and earthquakes.
Shermarke: That's true. They feel that something has gone wrong with
these places, running contrary to their will.
Mao: You are disobeying the will of Italy, Britain and France.
Shermarke: Our independence has not been long and we cherish it very
much. We ourselves will take responsibility and establish our dignity. For
quite a long period in the past we were dominated and now we shall be
masters of our own history. In the past the Western colonialists did not
treat us as human beings, but only as things.
Mao: They value things only because they are useful. Men are useful
when they can create wealth, but useless otherwise. Now we are creating
wealth for ourselves instead of for them, so they curse us every day,
especially the United States. The main target of your struggle is not the
United States, is it? The main target of our struggle is the United States,
while Britain, France, Italy and West Germany come behind. The United
States has set up many military bases to encircle us; you know this. Do
you have diplomatic relations with Japan?
Shermarke: Yes, we do. But Japan does not have an embassy in Somali.
Mao: We do not have diplomatic relations with Japan, because it does
not recognize us, but follows the United States.
Shermarke: It is the Japanese government, not the Japanese people.
Mao: The Japanese people are very good and we have very close
relations with them. The American people are not against China and we
have exchanges with many Americans. The same is true of our relations
with Britain, France and other European countries.
Shermarke: To us, the main targets of our struggle are Britain, France
and Italy, then the United States. Countries such as Britain, France and
Italy take Africa as their sphere of influence. It means when the United
States takes an interest in Africa they consider it interference in their
internal affairs. The United States finds it hard to accomplish anything
without their agreement. They feel that since Africa was their colonies,
they have the right to keep their spheres of influence. Now that over 80
percent of African countries have won independence, Africans cherish their
dignity and will never allow Africa to be the sphere of influence of others.
Mao: The old practice of taking African countries as one's sphere of
influence is no longer feasible. Now over 30 African countries have won
independence. Some countries, such as Algeria, have won independence
through war, fighting eight years with tens of thousands of soldiers against
hundreds of thousands of troops. The fewer defeated the more. Why could
tens of thousands defeat hundreds of thousands? Because millions of Al-
gerians backed up and supported the tens of thousands of troops, while
the hundreds of thousands of French troops failed to have support from
the Algerian people. Most of the one million French among the ten million
Algerian population ran away. Another example is the United Arab Republic's fight against Britain and France to maintain sovereignty over the
Suez Canal.'^^ As a result the British and French fled and now the canal
is under the control of the United Arab Republic.
In short, the imperialist front is shrinking, shrinking by a large margin.
For instance, their hold in Africa is much smaller and they can no longer
control China's mainland I learned that you do not like the British charge
d'affaires in Beijing.
Shermarke: I do not hold grudges against anybody personally. What
we oppose is the British government's past policy. In the past, it made
deals seven times with our territory. At that time we were powerless, because
we were not independent. But after we won independence, Britain wanted
to give our territory to others, so we severed diplomatic relations. That is
why Britain now cannot keep its influence in Somali.
Mao: This is very good. When Britain and France used arms to seize
the Suez Canal, Egypt broke diplomatic relations with them. They resumed
relations only recently. After independence Guinea severed diplomatic relations with France and they were resumed last year.
Shermarke: Yes. These are all lessons and experiences in handling
relations with past rulers.
Mao: The United States does not recognize us; Japan does not have
diplomatic relations with us; Britain and the Netherlands just have semidiplomatic relations with us; France, Italy and West Germany do not have
diplomatic relations with us as yet, and Turkey, Greece, Portugal, Spain
and Belgium, which follow them, do not have diplomatic relations with
us.

Now the United States still occupies our Taiwan. If, first, the United
States hands back Taiwan to us; second, the United Nations admits us and
drives Chiang Kai-shek out; third, the economic blockade is lifted and
business is started; fourth, we and the United States recognize each other
and establish diplomatic relations—even if all these take place, we shall
still be against imperialism and against U.S. imperialists. It is not only a
question of China; it is also China's desire to unite with the majority of
people all over the world, so as to defeat imperialism. They hate China
most for this. We want not only to defeat imperialism domestically, but
also to eliminate imperialism worldwide. We do not have many weapons,
nor do we have an atom bomb or a developed economy, but we are for
the liberation of the people of the whole world from imperialist and
colonialist rule. Only then will the people of the world, including us, have
tranquility. Don't you believe it? In the final analysis, imperialism will be
defeated.
Shermarke: We believe it. People will work hard for their liberation.
If the people who have been under the rule of imperialists and colonialists
do not rise up on their own, but rely on the participation of foreign
countries, it means interference in their internal affairs.
Mao: The oppressed people will rise up sooner or later.
Shermarke: Freedom is obtained mainly through the local people.
Mao: I totally agree. We feel that backing up means support, offering
economic assistance and aid in weapons when necessary. Take Algeria, for
example; we offered arms aid.
Shermarke: That's because the Algerian people expressed their desire for
independence and appealed for assistance. If the Algerian people had not
shown a desire for independence, then what was to be done?
Mao: We could do nothing, absolutely nothing, but wait for the people
to awaken and rise to the struggle. China waited for over 100 years before
the mainland was liberated, and Taiwan may have to wait several decades.
The liberation of the whole world has to wait for quite some time. As for
Taiwan, we are not prepared to liberate it by force. One reason is that
American troops are stationed in Taiwan and we would be waging war
against the United States if our army attacked. Britain does not have a
large military force in Hong Kong and we may take over if we want to.
But a treaty was signed in the past, under which a small part was ceded
and most was leased. The period of the lease is 99 years, with 34 years
to go before its expiration. This is a special case and we are not planning
to touch it. You may not understand it.
Shermarke: If the Hong Kong people want liberation and to drive
Britain away, can you refuse to offer assistance?
Mao: Hong Kong people are Chinese like us. Hong Kong is an
important path for trade. If we get control of it right now, it won't benefit
world trade, nor will it benefit our trade relations with other countries. It
does not mean we shall never touch it. Britain feels at ease now, but may
feel uneasy about it in the future.
(From the verbatim record)