Mate: I have some theoretical questions that are unclear to me, and I’d like to raise them here.
Mr. Chairman is a first-rate theoretician in the world. I wonder if you might have time to answer them?  Mao Zedong: That way of putting it isn’t correct.  Mate: I’ve read many theoretical works.
I believe that only Lenin’s and your own writings are the best.  Mao: I’m busy with work and don’t have enough time to study theoretical issues in depth.  Mate: In my view, what is called Marxism-Leninism refers to the works of Marx and Lenin.
Among these, the materialist component pertaining to epistemology constitutes a universal truth, while another part consists of concrete, practical doctrines that must be tested in practice.
In this regard, do the latter kinds of doctrines within Marxism-Leninism need to be constantly revised?  Mao: Your statement is not appropriate. Marxism-Leninism has remained unchanged to this day.
Materialism is not equivalent to Marxism-Leninism. Materialism existed even before the emergence of Marxism; the bourgeoisie once advanced materialistic ideas, such as French materialism.
Likewise, dialectics was not discovered by Marx. For example, Germany previously had idealist dialectics.
Marx transformed both of these elements. He turned materialism into dialectical materialism, holding that the world is interconnected and in constant development.
Why does development occur? Because contradictions exist.
He also transformed dialectics into dialectical materialism.
Dialectical materialism is a form of dialectics that accurately reflects the objective world, differing from Hegel’s idealist dialectics in Germany.
As for conclusions reached by Marx and Lenin on specific issues that may have been inappropriate, such cases are possible due to the limitations of the conditions prevailing at the time—for instance, Marx’s assertion that the proletarian revolution would first triumph simultaneously in several Western countries.  Mate: This is precisely the question I wanted to ask.  Mao: Lenin has already resolved this issue.  Mate: Lenin modified certain Marxist doctrines, arguing that the proletarian revolution could achieve victory in a single country.  Mao: Marx and Engels did indeed state that the proletarian revolution would break out simultaneously in several economically and culturally more developed nations, but this conclusion has since been altered.
For example, Russia’s economy lagged behind that of Western Europe, yet it was the first to succeed in its revolution.
This proves that the proletarian revolution can indeed first triumph in one country.  Mate: This was something unforeseen; even Lenin only realized it afterward.  Mao: Lenin had already recognized this before the October Revolution.  Mate: But that was after the February Revolution.  Mao: It was during the later stages of his research that Lenin identified the imperialist stage of capitalist development, discerning the law of uneven development within capitalism. He understood that this could lead to a world war and potentially spark revolutions first in one or several countries, including those in the East.  Mate: Lenin only came to see this later.  Mao: Lenin studied this problem during World War I and concluded that the proletarian revolution could first succeed in a single country.
[2] Of course, he did not anticipate in which particular country this would occur first.  Mate: Lenin maintained that the dictatorship of the proletariat could only be exercised by a single party, whereas you, Mr. Chairman, have said that the dictatorship of the proletariat can be jointly exercised by several parties. Does this constitute a departure from Marxism-Leninism?  Mao: It cannot be considered a departure from Marxism-Leninism.
China’s democratic revolution can be regarded as having been carried out jointly by several political parties, with the Communist Party taking the lead.
China has undergone two major revolutions: prior to 1949, there was the bourgeois democratic revolution, which addressed the tasks of opposing imperialism, feudalism, and the rule of the Kuomintang. At that time, we did not touch the property rights of the national bourgeoisie. The subsequent revolution, as you are aware, did indeed affect the property rights of the national bourgeoisie, as well as those of individual handicraftsmen and small farmers.
The socialist transformation of these forms of ownership proceeded through several stages.
After several years, the second revolution was essentially completed.
Both of these revolutions were led by the Communist Party.  Mate: I learned about China’s liberation the very next day.
China’s socialist transformation took place after its liberation. Although China embarked on the socialist path, this had long been foreseen.  Mao: We first targeted comprador capital, leaving national capital untouched for several years.
As for individual peasants, we first distributed land to them as private property, and only in a second step did we organize them into cooperatives.
With respect to national capital, we carried out the transformation in several stages, culminating in public-private joint ventures.
The state adopted a policy of peaceful redemption, gradually buying out these enterprises over several years.
Now, all enterprises that formerly belonged to national capital are under state management.
Historically, China’s capitalism consisted mainly of bureaucratic capital and imperialist capital, accounting for eighty percent, while national capital made up only twenty percent.
Once bureaucratic and imperialist capital were taken over by the state, the bulk of capital had already come under state control.
We pursued a lenient policy toward national capital.  Mate: I fully agree with China’s approach.  Mao: Capitalists are now cooperating with us.  Mate: There is another theoretical question: why did Marxism first triumph in economically backward countries of the East?  Mao: The reason is quite simple.
The rulers of Eastern countries were unable to solve their own national problems. The primary task facing the peoples of these regions was to resist imperialism and feudalism.
These countries had been exploited by Western powers and had fallen into extreme poverty.
By “East” here, we mean Asia, Africa, and Latin America—the so-called rear areas of imperialism.  Mate: Some of the practical components of Marxism-Leninism are no longer applicable today.
For example, in Western countries, the economy is monopolized, but politically things are not entirely so, because there remains freedom—freedom that does not impede social development.
Therefore, is it possible to separate the economic system of monopoly from political authoritarianism?  Mao: First, we need to analyze the nature of the dictatorship. The so-called freedom in Western countries is, in reality, the freedom of capitalists to exploit others.  Mate: I agree.  China has liberated people economically.  Mao: The ruling power in Western countries cannot be held by the majority; it is controlled solely by capitalists—this is dictatorship.  Mate: Then why haven’t the communist parties in those countries come to power?  Mao: Because the capitalists won’t allow it.  Mate: In Chile, it is possible for the Communist Party to come to power.  Mao: Today, more people still vote for the bourgeoisie.  Mate: Why is that?  Mao: China was the same in the past. At first, very few supported us.
Over twenty-eight years, from 1921 to 1949, we gradually won the support of the people.  Mate: Western countries have been going through this for centuries, and they will likely continue to do so for another hundred years.  Mao: However, the situation going forward will change.  Mate: Of course it will. That requires a new plan.  Mao: When Marx was alive, he couldn’t foresee all the problems that would arise later, nor could he resolve them then.
Problems concerning Russia could only be solved by Lenin, and those concerning China could only be solved by the Chinese themselves.  Mate: The resolution of problems in Western countries and Latin American countries will be influenced by the October Revolution and the Chinese Revolution. Yet you speak of this as a victory for Marxism-Leninism, rather than as a victory achieved through the application of dialectical materialism.
If you adopt this attitude toward Marxism-Leninism, the people of Latin America will begin to doubt it.  Mao: The worldview of dialectical materialism forms the theoretical foundation of the Communist Party.
The theory of the dictatorship of the proletariat and class struggle constitutes the revolutionary theory—that is, the theory that applies this worldview to observe and resolve revolutionary problems.
Marxism-Leninism should comprise three parts: first, the philosophy of Marxism-Leninism, which serves as the theoretical foundation; second, the economics of Marxism-Leninism, which is the doctrine used to examine economic phenomena from a Marxist perspective; and third, the revolutionary doctrines of Marxism-Leninism, such as those concerning class struggle, political parties, and the dictatorship of the proletariat.
These three components should not be separated but rather regarded as three organically connected parts of Marxism-Leninism.  Mate: If the worldview remains unchanged, does that mean the revolutionary theoretical component can be altered?  Mao: It depends on which theory we’re talking about.
For example, the theory positing that revolution will first succeed in one or several countries represents a modification of Marx and Engels’ original conclusions.  Mate: If the content of today’s conversation were to be published, would some people think that you, Mr. Chairman, have betrayed Marxism-Leninism?  Mao: I don’t believe China has betrayed Marxism-Leninism.
The Chinese Communist Party has consistently upheld the principles of Marxism-Leninism because it is a universal truth.
This concerns the unity of a universal truth with China’s specific circumstances.
Printed based on the transcript of the conversation preserved in the Central Archives.  Notes [1] This is an excerpt from Mao Zedong’s conversation with Arturo Mate Alessandri, editor-in-chief of the Chilean newspaper Última Hora.
See Lenin’s “On the Slogan of a European Federation” (August 1915)
(August 1915): “Socialism may first achieve victory among a small number of capitalist countries, or even in just one.”
See Lenin’s “On the Slogan of a European Federation” (August 1915)

: “Socialism may first achieve victory among a small number of capitalist countries, or even in just one.”